The United States and Russia have begun talks to end the war in Ukraine. But Ukraine wasn’t there.

The United States and Russia just completed their first round of diplomatic talks to end the war in Ukraine since the start of Russian invasion in 2022. The exclusion of Ukraine representatives from the talks signals a new approach and new U.S. interests in the region.

Host Martine Powers talks with White House correspondent Michael Birnbaum about Trump’s conversation with Russian President Vladimir Putin, and why the United States’ actions over the past week have alarmed its European allies.

Today’s show was produced by Bishop Sand. It was edited by Lucy Perkins and mixed by Sam Bair.

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